Well its a big day for America....... The first day of the new President........ Never could expectation and hopes be so high when conversely actual conditions are so poor and the economic out look be so dire.
Heres hoping he will be able to meet all those amazingly high expectations....... heres to you Barack Obama....... first African American President of the mighty US of A.
Im here in Trinidad in Port of Spain having got up this morning in the snow of Munich...... 3 flights and a long old time later.......... just got here to this Caribbean capital now its 2AM...... Im in the mega flash Hyatt ..... very nice Matt but I think we are over doing it!!!!!!
Cheers Jez XXXX
www.jezblog.com
PS...... great start for Barrack Obama maybe this will be carved in stone :
"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals. Our Founding Fathers, faced with perils we can scarcely imagine, drafted a charter to assure the rule of law and the rights of man, a charter expanded by the blood of generations. Those ideals still light the world, and we will not give them up for expedience's sake. And so to all other peoples and governments who are watching today, from the grandest capitals to the small village where my father was born: know that America is a friend of each nation and every man, woman, and child who seeks a future of peace and dignity, and that we are ready to lead once more."
"We will not apologize for our way of life, nor will we waver in its defense, and for those who seek to advance their aims by inducing terror and slaughtering innocents, we say to you now that our spirit is stronger and cannot be broken; you cannot outlast us, and we will defeat you."
Now theres an opportunity for JK & G..I gather Obama is a big smoker..the perfect poster boy for BAM in the developing world![reply]Maid Emilio x @ January 21, 2009, 5:02 am
You should get a job as a sub editor! LOL xx[reply]Maid Emilioxx @ January 21, 2009, 12:36 pm
Its the way to go ask uncle Jo and his disappearing comrades.... if you do not fit history you are toast... and whats more you r no longer in the photos..... hehehehe.......[reply]Jezblog @ January 22, 2009, 2:43 pm
The only think I could think of was "this is stuff for legends"....[reply]Tim @ January 21, 2009, 9:11 am
Fantastic day. I hate to say this but remember Barrack Obama gave Israel "the green light" to "do something about" Gaza when he visited Israel during the election campaign in July- and the Israeli press say the operation was 6 months in the planning.. so who's peace and dignity? Who's terror?[reply]John Harris @ January 21, 2009, 3:50 pm
Come come now John.... he has signed an order to close down Guantanamo today..... lets judge him by his actions not by motivations we have chosen to assign to him ..... maybe he can bring justice and an end to terror in the middle east but thats a tall order.... the Israelis have their own time table of elections etc to deal with they are not necessarily looking to a Senator running for President of the US for guidance..... and in reality they are contending with the Hammas rockets. I think they do genuinely fear that if those rubbish rockets were replaced by proper accurate weapons that Hammas would be in a position to slaughter thousands in those nearby Israeli cities so in their own terms they are justified in seeking to smash Hammas and its system of smuggling tunnels etc.... I am not saying their actions are justified I am saying they make their own judgements on what keeps them safe ..... the decision to attack Gaza was not made in DC.
Come on baby lets give Barrack a chance.... its his first day!!! hehehehe....
Cheers Jez XXXXXX[reply]Jezblog @ January 22, 2009, 3:14 pm
Hello Jez Coulson,
I was reminding you of an uncomfortable fact, perhaps his visit to southern Israel wasn't reported in the US and therefore didn't happen, the Israelis certainly appreciated the encouragement. It is extraordinary how successful the Israelis have been in shaping opinion, at least in the West, of Israel as "victims" as you say "justified in their own terms". You know perfectly well that the appalling slaughter in Gaza will not make Israel more secure - and which should have been immediately condemned by all on humanitarian grounds. Israel will eventually have to accept the Palestinians have rights and come to a political solution if they want peace. There are some Israelis saying this. Some soldiers have been refusing to fight. Regurgitating a "road map" to peace that excludes Hamas won't work.
It is extraordinary the extent to which America's future seems to be riding on this one man - however brilliant. It would be shame the if American faith in their leaders blinded them to the necessity of building social movement(s) that demands the kind of changes that will get us out of this crisis and make the US a force for good. Or at least to start asking some of the questions now that the neoliberal project has failed so publicly.
Hello Jez Coulson,
I was reminding you of an uncomfortable fact, perhaps his visit to southern Israel wasn't reported in the US and therefore didn't happen, the Israelis certainly appreciated the encouragement. It is extraordinary how successful the Israelis have been in shaping opinion, at least in the West, of Israel as "victims" as you say "justified in their own terms". You know perfectly well that the appalling slaughter in Gaza will not make Israel more secure - and which should have been immediately condemned by all on humanitarian grounds. Israel will eventually have to accept the Palestinians have rights and come to a political solution if they want peace. There are some Israelis saying this. Some soldiers have been refusing to fight. Regurgitating a "road map" to peace that excludes Hamas won't work.
It is extraordinary the extent to which America's future seems to be riding on this one man - however brilliant. It would be shame the if American faith in their leaders blinded them to the necessity of building social movement(s) that demands the kind of changes that will get us out of this crisis and make the US a force for good. Or at least to start asking some of the questions now that the neoliberal project has failed so publicly.
He was there....... I was hoping he might visit some palestinian territory maybe put a toe into Palestinian controlled West Bank somewhere..... but in all honesty Im not surprised he did not. For instance No American President could visit Gaza ....... Islamic fundamentalists don't generally make much distinction between liberals and hawks they like to try and kill all Americans..... and American Presidents (or candidates) well there is pretty well no way they could go there and live....
There has to be some recognition he cannot visit Palestinian held territory because of the actions of Palestinian Islamic fundamentalists...... its not primarily a reflection of Obama's politics but a reflection of the actions of Hammas.
Clearly since the rise of Hammas its much more difficult to broker a solution.
Suicide bombings and the culture of the Shahid..... the martyrs.... has damaged the largely educated decent secular orientated society of before..... Palestinians of Gaza have turned away from Western leaning more hopeful solution based politics back to a nihilistic 'from the river to the Sea is Islamic land' stance.... the position of the Hammas charter is that all jews will be driven into the sea.
Its difficult for Israelis living next door to this...... but clearly the only way forward is and always was a two state solution...... I have always supported this...... Arafat was offered pretty well something that he should have accepted but even he (a basically secular politician) could not concede........ he turned back to the violence of the second Intifada..... but the never ending culture of hatred and self sacrifice is perfect for the nihilism of Islamic fundamentalism and therefore the rise of Hammas.
I don't support sending the tanks into Gaza but I have some recognition that the Israelis are forced to live next door to this culture where suicide, slaughter and hatred are venerated. They are afraid...... they think they are taking practical measures to protect themselves...... they have to live there.
The fact that Israel is largely responsible for having created these conditions does not alter the fact that its difficult to live next door to a grim failed state run by Hammas.
Clearly ..... It is a war crime to fire tank shells at a UN run shelter for people fleeing their homes...... people trapped in a conflict zone.
Hammas has declared victory...... they have won of course..... their disgusting behavior has made Israel behave in a more disgusting way...... hundreds of Palestinians have died...... Israel has been shamed..... the more Palestinians die the better for Hammas....... Victory for hatred and never ending conflict.
We have to be truthful to ourselves in looking at the situation in Gaza of course we should condemn the Israeli action but we have to be truthful about the role of Hammas we cant just pretend this action is unprovoked otherwise there is never any emphasis on making Palestinian militants look towards compromise and limiting their behavior toward behavior that that can allow some kind of two state solution to go forward....... some kind of land for peace deal....... like the Israelis had with Egypt...... land was given back..... there was no further violence........ land for peace..... one side has to deliver land the other peace.
My view is Hammas does not want this........ it wants a constant state of war or victory in which jews are driven from the whole of Palestine/Israel or killed...... they are the rulers of Gaza they have killed or driven out Fatah / PLO secular opposition types ...... its difficult to see a way forward in Gaza.
If there is no solution in Obama's term...... well it might not be his fault.
Cheers Jez XXXXX[reply]Jezblog @ January 23, 2009, 11:23 am
Hi Jez
I didn't say BO should have visited Gaza? I reminded you of what he said on his visit to what were once and in living memory - Palestinian villages.
Much is made of "nihilism of Islamic fundamentalism", although Hamas was willing to negotiate in the only interview I heard during the attack- though were exasperated that Palestinian rights were not getting a mention. The caricature of political Islam is well established in the Western narrative but I don't think it is helpful anymore than accepting the "we just want quiet" Israeli propaganda. You say "the Israelis are forced to live next door to this culture where suicide, slaughter and hatred are venerated" (and here I assume you are leaving aside the images of parents & slaughtered children that have come out of Gaza) but Israel engendered Hammas (actually Israel supported them initially against the PLO). Hammas were elected because Fatah/PLO had been treated with contempt by Israel and were the only ones trying to resist the blockade - the siege is a very old form of warfare. IDF broke the cease fire- the terms of which they had not complied and launched the attack at a time that was not unhelpful to their allies (and the $3 billion per annum in US military aid) but essentially the attack was for domestic electoral purposes - you don't get elected in Israel unless you are tough on Palestinians.
I rather feel your argument rests on the same assumptions as the Israelis assertions - "resistance is futile" and that Palestinians only bring it down on their own heads... lets blame the real victims. Do you really think that Hammas want never ending death & slaughter? If they couldn't loose that is because the IDF couldn't win! I think the Pres. will try and avoid that caricature, the "mad mullah terrorist" territory along with the "war on terror".
The Zionists hold that the Jewish people are superior to the other Arabs (anecdotally to a ratio of 1:100, 13 dead Israelis leading to 1300 dead Palestinians) and that racism, sad to say, is I feel the crux of the problem. Add to that the tactic of ghettoization, collective punishment of captive populations and the historical precedents get very nasty if not ironic - and will only create a thirst for revenge. How is the 4th biggest military power in the world to become more secure? Not by force, not by even this latest level of force Jez - yes they will have to reverse the terror they used to take over their neighbors land. As long as the Western powers support them in oppressing the Palestinians I can only see hope in the dissenters of Israel who know it is wrong and the resistance in Gaza & the West bank.
I'm not attacking Obama in particular. People round the world welcome the order to close Guantanamo (and the other facilities) - from here torture looked ridiculous anyway. But the contradictions in which he takes on the mantel are real enough.
Hey John....... I am not a supporter of Zionism ...... I am a supporter of a decent solution for both parties......otherwise there can be no end....... sadly I think the Israelis have missed their opportunity to make peace with more secular leaders........and I was one pushing that they should do it while the secular leaders still had authority......... Hammas are in power now in Gaza for many reasons and their beginnings were certainly financed and assisted by Israeli action...... rather like the Taliban against the Soviets receiving US money....... thats all in the past.
The peace needs to be forged now.
There is no point in demonizing the Israelis beyond the truth.
They hold most of the power...... the whole situation is mostly their fault.
But Hammas needs to be held accountable for its actions too otherwise there can be no peace.... they have to accept their actions bring counter reaction......
Their election on their racist fundamentalist charter in the first place led to a distancing and lowering of support from all democratic countries.
Their slaughter of the secular opposition in Gaza led to the blockade.
Their insistence on firing rockets has brought this attack.
Their promotion of suicide bombing as a venerated method of resistance has pushed their society into vile religious fervor over logical solutions.... grief is replaced by congratulations......
To pretend the Israelis would be doing these attacks if there were no rocket fire is not correct in my view.
You have to be careful not to slide into racism against the Israelis claiming they re doing it because they are monsters is the language of Iran who have clearly stated their position in terms of wiping out the jews of Israel.
The Israelis ...... They have more power...... they should exercise more control....... they need to find a way to make peace...... they have created this situation..... They appear to have committed war crimes in this attack....... these are all true and yet still they are not attacking Gaza unprovoked.
The political leaders of both sides leave a lot to be desired..... but the Hammas leaders are the only ones who have slaughtered and driven out their internal political opponents.
thank you for your reply. One of the significances of the new president is hope renewed. It is an enormous relief after Bush and a tremendous responsibility - but one happily backed by overwhelming public support.
You make a good point about the loss of the opportunity to negotiate with secular Arab nationalism. I disagree with much of what you say about Hamas, rhetoric always has to face the reality- they were ready to give de facto recognition & negotiate a long term cease fire. I'm sorry but the attack on Gaza was "monstrous", so it might stick. I still feel the central question is will this make the Israelis more secure? If Israel succeeded in destroying Hamas (and they have now destroyed any infrastructure of civil society), what would take their place? The Israelis are not the victims of provocation - though that has been the resulting coverage of their media campaign and the exclusion of journalists from Gaza, both before and during the assault, the symbolic (by comparison with the far more successful and experimental Israeli weapons) fertilizer based rockets are about the only resistance Palestinians could make to a deadly siege. As for suicide attacks against an enemy - check your history man eg WW2, that can be religious or secular but usually involves retribution against a hated enemy predicated by intimate personal loss. Anyway Hamas will have to be included in any "logical solution". Remember Thatcher, the IRA and all the rest.
It is not anti Semitic to criticize Israel's militaristic and right wing policies, though it is the usual smear. I am very sensitive to issues of racism but the antecedents of Zionism have to be recognised: Theodore Herzl, the founder of Zionism, long argued that they could never integrate because racism was endemic and universal so they must have "their own" country. That the European Jewish colonial settlement of Palestine was ³the rampart of Europe against Asia, an outpost of civilisation against barbarism²... I'm afraid it has got them into a terrible hole.. In the end they will have to accept a multiethnic state in my view. They could peacefully transition to an equal society where Palestinians are given the same rights as in post apartheid South Africa. There could be enormous economic benefits all round - as Herzl at one point envisaged (at this rate I will have to start providing source foot notes!:o)
We should stand for equal rights and justice for all.
If the current Israeli regime will not allow a democratic state or a meaningful separate Palestinian state then what? If democracy is unacceptable then apparently the plan is to slice the Palestinians into smaller and smaller areas (or body parts) and push the remainder in to neighboring countries- complete the ethnic cleansing - whilst presumably we wring our hands and our governments are quietly relieved.
If i may, I will point you at a John Pilger article (who is a rather better writer than me!:0) if you haven't already read it: http://www.coldtype.net/Assets.09/pdfs/0109.Extra1.Gaza.pdf
In the opening stand first of cold type (the site you recommend) this is stated:
'The state terror unleashed from the skies and on the ground against the Gaza Strip as we speak has nothing to do with Hamas. It has nothing to do with “Terror”'
This is of course not true..... Otherwise why are the Israelis not doing it in the West Bank ? Why are they not doing it in Ramallah or Nablus ? If the Israelis were just doing it because they wanted to kill Palestinians or destroy the infra structure of their lives they could bomb the West Bank..... The truth is the West Bank Palestinians are not firing rockets on Israeli cities or currently sending out suicide bombers. The attack on Gaza is entirely because Gaza is ruled by Hammas and because of actions taken by Hammas.
It does not mean the attack on Gaza is justified or a good idea in terms of the long term security of Israel. Or even that the whole precept is not a war crime.
The attack on Gaza is entirely and wholly as a response to the fact that Hammas run Gaza and that they constantly send rockets on to Israel. It is exactly the kind of vile response that Hammas are hoping to provoke, that is the point of those missiles.. They have claimed victory and indeed they have won. They want the Iranian view of the jews of Israel to be held by all.
People viewing the situation from West should not fall into the vile 'We are all Hezbollah now' rubbish thinking unless they support the wholesale slaughter of jews and they are supporters of 'From the river to the Sea' is islamic land.
I do not support the attack on Gaza.
I do understand that Hammas terror and constant rocket fire is massively important to Israeli thinking.
It is possible to be a supporter of justice for Palestinians and Palestinian rights while opposing the actions of Hammas. The actions of Hammas after all make any real negotiated solution less likely.
Liberal jews of Israel do not necessarily support an attack on Gaza...... some are organizing in opposition to it...... but all jews of Israel know that Hammas is a threat to them ..... Its charter calls for their destruction. All Israelis are right to fear Hammas it is a Islamofascist organization whose charter calls for the slaughter of the jews of Israel. Liberal people in the West should not muddle up support for human rights and justice for Palestinians with support for Hammas.
We should be clear on this.
Cheers Jez XX
PS......... I will read the rest of John Pilger later but sadly I am already pre disposed to be skeptical he is the one journalist in the world who has fallen from being a hero of mine to being someone I no longer trust.......solely because of his writing from the wars in the former Yugoslavia. He managed to pretend that the US forces whose intervention ended the ethnic cleansing and slaughter of muslim people in Bosnia were the bad guys..... and that the actual perpetrators of genocide the Serbian irregular forces were the good guys........ just because he insisted in viewing the whole conflict through a distorting view of imperialism and counter imperialism when the overwhelming issue for decent people looking in and innocent muslims living in Bosnia was the abuse of human rights and genocide.
The Israel's have indeed been justifying their actions by referring to rocket fire whilst they in fact broke the cease fire (& having continued the siege). As I understand it there haven't been any suicide bombings during the cease fire.
I think Lowenstein is arguing in the article you quote that the conflict is that of the powerful gaining & maintaining hegemony over the weak, and suggests Israel has not intended and will not allow a two state solution.
Israel will accept no
authority in the Palestinian territories
that it does not ultimately control. Any
individual, leader, faction or movement
that fails to accede to Israel¹s demands
or that seeks genuine sovereignty and
the equality of all nations in the region;
any government or popular movement
that demands the applicability of inter-
national humanitarian law and of the
universal declaration of human rights for
its own people will be unacceptable for
the Jewish State.
Anyway I thought you might be interested in a different perspective from the dominant narrative - which even cowers the BBC here. Still it is a powerful rhetoric and what is repeated often enough and loudly enough.... does become the justification.
The best way to undermine resistance is to find a political solution - using force hasn't crushed the Palestinians in 60 years. We should be clear on this- if Hamas are a group that can't be included in this process then some other "solution" will be found.
Using military force to destroy governments that we dislike seems to me anyway to be one of the policies the rest of the world is hoping the West & their allies might drop.
cheers
John
PS pls send me the Pilger link on the former Yugoslavia[reply]John Harris @ January 26, 2009, 7:36 pm
'The American attack on Yugoslavia began more than a decade ago when the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund set about destroying the multi-ethnic federation with lethal doses of debt, "market reforms" and imposed poverty.'
John Im not sure this is the best example..... its just the first thing to come up on search and refers back obviously written at the time of Kosova...... but you do see how the actuality on the ground is ignored in favor of discussion about capitalism and the forces of American imperialism and the Military industrial complex.........
My own recollection is that at first the US allowed the Europeans to attempt to end the war they only intervened after the UN and Europe had completely failed........ Dutch troops had stood by and allowed the disgusting slaughter in Srebrinica....... the putrid ethnic cleansing and vile slaughter of real people meant that Clinton felt he could no longer watch and do nothing and he felt compelled to commit forces to ending the vile abuses that had characterized the Croatian and Bosnian conflict........ US soldiers intervened in Bosnia to save muslim lives...... you don't hear too much of that in Pilger's writing....... I was there thats how it went down in my recollection.
Pilger's stuff reads to me like some ridiculous Marxist professor writing from some university library in Aberdeen or Toronto miles away only referring to huge machiavellian forces real or imagined not referring to the absolute reality....... or how indeed unarmed muslim or croat families would survive the Serbian irregular forces?.......US/NATO forces combined with US/NATO diplomacy ended the Bosnian conflict and by so doing they saved thousands of Muslim lives...... thats the truth of it..... try finding that in anything Pilger has written.
Nice shot! Wish I could have been in US to witness this historic day. [reply]PeterS @ January 21, 2009, 6:55 pm
Exceptional portrait. You must be proud of this capture.[reply]sherri @ January 22, 2009, 12:12 am
Wonderful Jez, that is wonderful. We seek a free world? So there will be a price to pay? We will all pay. To have that peace, we as people of any nation will create war to suppress the those that suppress.[reply]Julio A. Ibarra Borroto @ January 22, 2009, 12:34 am
that's a Very Important Photo !!!!!
congrats.[reply]paolo @ January 22, 2009, 5:11 am
have fun around the world! cheers :D
ps clear portrait! like it[reply]garghe @ January 22, 2009, 6:29 am
A real happy camper, and the most powerful man on the planet, I guess he has something to smile about ;-)Claus Petersen @ February 7, 2009, 7:56 pm
More+
Well its a big day for America....... The first day of the new President........ Never could expectation and hopes be so high when conversely actual conditions are so poor and the economic out look be so dire.
Heres hoping he will be able to meet all those amazingly high expectations....... heres to you Barack Obama....... first African American President of the mighty US of A.
Im here in Trinidad in Port of Spain having got up this morning in the snow of Munich...... 3 flights and a long old time later.......... just got here to this Caribbean capital now its 2AM...... Im in the mega flash Hyatt ..... very nice Matt but I think we are over doing it!!!!!!
Cheers Jez XXXX
www.jezblog.com
PS...... great start for Barrack Obama maybe this will be carved in stone :
"As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals. Our Founding Fathers, faced with perils we can scarcely imagine, drafted a charter to assure the rule of law and the rights of man, a charter expanded by the blood of generations. Those ideals still light the world, and we will not give them up for expedience's sake. And so to all other peoples and governments who are watching today, from the grandest capitals to the small village where my father was born: know that America is a friend of each nation and every man, woman, and child who seeks a future of peace and dignity, and that we are ready to lead once more."
"We will not apologize for our way of life, nor will we waver in its defense, and for those who seek to advance their aims by inducing terror and slaughtering innocents, we say to you now that our spirit is stronger and cannot be broken; you cannot outlast us, and we will defeat you."
President Barack Obama
[reply]Jaime Alberto @ January 21, 2009, 4:50 am
[reply]Maid Emilio x @ January 21, 2009, 5:02 am
[reply]Maid Emilioxx @ January 21, 2009, 12:36 pm
[reply]Jezblog @ January 22, 2009, 2:43 pm
[reply]Tim @ January 21, 2009, 9:11 am
[reply]John Harris @ January 21, 2009, 3:50 pm
Come on baby lets give Barrack a chance.... its his first day!!! hehehehe....
Cheers Jez XXXXXX
[reply]Jezblog @ January 22, 2009, 3:14 pm
I was reminding you of an uncomfortable fact, perhaps his visit to southern Israel wasn't reported in the US and therefore didn't happen, the Israelis certainly appreciated the encouragement. It is extraordinary how successful the Israelis have been in shaping opinion, at least in the West, of Israel as "victims" as you say "justified in their own terms". You know perfectly well that the appalling slaughter in Gaza will not make Israel more secure - and which should have been immediately condemned by all on humanitarian grounds. Israel will eventually have to accept the Palestinians have rights and come to a political solution if they want peace. There are some Israelis saying this. Some soldiers have been refusing to fight. Regurgitating a "road map" to peace that excludes Hamas won't work.
It is extraordinary the extent to which America's future seems to be riding on this one man - however brilliant. It would be shame the if American faith in their leaders blinded them to the necessity of building social movement(s) that demands the kind of changes that will get us out of this crisis and make the US a force for good. Or at least to start asking some of the questions now that the neoliberal project has failed so publicly.
Hello Jez Coulson,
I was reminding you of an uncomfortable fact, perhaps his visit to southern Israel wasn't reported in the US and therefore didn't happen, the Israelis certainly appreciated the encouragement. It is extraordinary how successful the Israelis have been in shaping opinion, at least in the West, of Israel as "victims" as you say "justified in their own terms". You know perfectly well that the appalling slaughter in Gaza will not make Israel more secure - and which should have been immediately condemned by all on humanitarian grounds. Israel will eventually have to accept the Palestinians have rights and come to a political solution if they want peace. There are some Israelis saying this. Some soldiers have been refusing to fight. Regurgitating a "road map" to peace that excludes Hamas won't work.
It is extraordinary the extent to which America's future seems to be riding on this one man - however brilliant. It would be shame the if American faith in their leaders blinded them to the necessity of building social movement(s) that demands the kind of changes that will get us out of this crisis and make the US a force for good. Or at least to start asking some of the questions now that the neoliberal project has failed so publicly.
Cheers
John
[reply]John Harris @ January 23, 2009, 10:14 am
There has to be some recognition he cannot visit Palestinian held territory because of the actions of Palestinian Islamic fundamentalists...... its not primarily a reflection of Obama's politics but a reflection of the actions of Hammas.
Clearly since the rise of Hammas its much more difficult to broker a solution.
Suicide bombings and the culture of the Shahid..... the martyrs.... has damaged the largely educated decent secular orientated society of before..... Palestinians of Gaza have turned away from Western leaning more hopeful solution based politics back to a nihilistic 'from the river to the Sea is Islamic land' stance.... the position of the Hammas charter is that all jews will be driven into the sea.
Its difficult for Israelis living next door to this...... but clearly the only way forward is and always was a two state solution...... I have always supported this...... Arafat was offered pretty well something that he should have accepted but even he (a basically secular politician) could not concede........ he turned back to the violence of the second Intifada..... but the never ending culture of hatred and self sacrifice is perfect for the nihilism of Islamic fundamentalism and therefore the rise of Hammas.
I don't support sending the tanks into Gaza but I have some recognition that the Israelis are forced to live next door to this culture where suicide, slaughter and hatred are venerated. They are afraid...... they think they are taking practical measures to protect themselves...... they have to live there.
The fact that Israel is largely responsible for having created these conditions does not alter the fact that its difficult to live next door to a grim failed state run by Hammas.
Clearly ..... It is a war crime to fire tank shells at a UN run shelter for people fleeing their homes...... people trapped in a conflict zone.
Hammas has declared victory...... they have won of course..... their disgusting behavior has made Israel behave in a more disgusting way...... hundreds of Palestinians have died...... Israel has been shamed..... the more Palestinians die the better for Hammas....... Victory for hatred and never ending conflict.
We have to be truthful to ourselves in looking at the situation in Gaza of course we should condemn the Israeli action but we have to be truthful about the role of Hammas we cant just pretend this action is unprovoked otherwise there is never any emphasis on making Palestinian militants look towards compromise and limiting their behavior toward behavior that that can allow some kind of two state solution to go forward....... some kind of land for peace deal....... like the Israelis had with Egypt...... land was given back..... there was no further violence........ land for peace..... one side has to deliver land the other peace.
My view is Hammas does not want this........ it wants a constant state of war or victory in which jews are driven from the whole of Palestine/Israel or killed...... they are the rulers of Gaza they have killed or driven out Fatah / PLO secular opposition types ...... its difficult to see a way forward in Gaza.
If there is no solution in Obama's term...... well it might not be his fault.
Cheers Jez XXXXX
[reply]Jezblog @ January 23, 2009, 11:23 am
I didn't say BO should have visited Gaza? I reminded you of what he said on his visit to what were once and in living memory - Palestinian villages.
Much is made of "nihilism of Islamic fundamentalism", although Hamas was willing to negotiate in the only interview I heard during the attack- though were exasperated that Palestinian rights were not getting a mention. The caricature of political Islam is well established in the Western narrative but I don't think it is helpful anymore than accepting the "we just want quiet" Israeli propaganda. You say "the Israelis are forced to live next door to this culture where suicide, slaughter and hatred are venerated" (and here I assume you are leaving aside the images of parents & slaughtered children that have come out of Gaza) but Israel engendered Hammas (actually Israel supported them initially against the PLO). Hammas were elected because Fatah/PLO had been treated with contempt by Israel and were the only ones trying to resist the blockade - the siege is a very old form of warfare. IDF broke the cease fire- the terms of which they had not complied and launched the attack at a time that was not unhelpful to their allies (and the $3 billion per annum in US military aid) but essentially the attack was for domestic electoral purposes - you don't get elected in Israel unless you are tough on Palestinians.
I rather feel your argument rests on the same assumptions as the Israelis assertions - "resistance is futile" and that Palestinians only bring it down on their own heads... lets blame the real victims. Do you really think that Hammas want never ending death & slaughter? If they couldn't loose that is because the IDF couldn't win! I think the Pres. will try and avoid that caricature, the "mad mullah terrorist" territory along with the "war on terror".
The Zionists hold that the Jewish people are superior to the other Arabs (anecdotally to a ratio of 1:100, 13 dead Israelis leading to 1300 dead Palestinians) and that racism, sad to say, is I feel the crux of the problem. Add to that the tactic of ghettoization, collective punishment of captive populations and the historical precedents get very nasty if not ironic - and will only create a thirst for revenge. How is the 4th biggest military power in the world to become more secure? Not by force, not by even this latest level of force Jez - yes they will have to reverse the terror they used to take over their neighbors land. As long as the Western powers support them in oppressing the Palestinians I can only see hope in the dissenters of Israel who know it is wrong and the resistance in Gaza & the West bank.
I'm not attacking Obama in particular. People round the world welcome the order to close Guantanamo (and the other facilities) - from here torture looked ridiculous anyway. But the contradictions in which he takes on the mantel are real enough.
cheers
John
[reply]John Harris @ January 23, 2009, 2:08 pm
The peace needs to be forged now.
There is no point in demonizing the Israelis beyond the truth.
They hold most of the power...... the whole situation is mostly their fault.
But Hammas needs to be held accountable for its actions too otherwise there can be no peace.... they have to accept their actions bring counter reaction......
Their election on their racist fundamentalist charter in the first place led to a distancing and lowering of support from all democratic countries.
Their slaughter of the secular opposition in Gaza led to the blockade.
Their insistence on firing rockets has brought this attack.
Their promotion of suicide bombing as a venerated method of resistance has pushed their society into vile religious fervor over logical solutions.... grief is replaced by congratulations......
To pretend the Israelis would be doing these attacks if there were no rocket fire is not correct in my view.
You have to be careful not to slide into racism against the Israelis claiming they re doing it because they are monsters is the language of Iran who have clearly stated their position in terms of wiping out the jews of Israel.
The Israelis ...... They have more power...... they should exercise more control....... they need to find a way to make peace...... they have created this situation..... They appear to have committed war crimes in this attack....... these are all true and yet still they are not attacking Gaza unprovoked.
The political leaders of both sides leave a lot to be desired..... but the Hammas leaders are the only ones who have slaughtered and driven out their internal political opponents.
Cheers Jez XXXXXXXX
[reply]Jezblog @ January 23, 2009, 2:41 pm
thank you for your reply. One of the significances of the new president is hope renewed. It is an enormous relief after Bush and a tremendous responsibility - but one happily backed by overwhelming public support.
You make a good point about the loss of the opportunity to negotiate with secular Arab nationalism. I disagree with much of what you say about Hamas, rhetoric always has to face the reality- they were ready to give de facto recognition & negotiate a long term cease fire. I'm sorry but the attack on Gaza was "monstrous", so it might stick. I still feel the central question is will this make the Israelis more secure? If Israel succeeded in destroying Hamas (and they have now destroyed any infrastructure of civil society), what would take their place? The Israelis are not the victims of provocation - though that has been the resulting coverage of their media campaign and the exclusion of journalists from Gaza, both before and during the assault, the symbolic (by comparison with the far more successful and experimental Israeli weapons) fertilizer based rockets are about the only resistance Palestinians could make to a deadly siege. As for suicide attacks against an enemy - check your history man eg WW2, that can be religious or secular but usually involves retribution against a hated enemy predicated by intimate personal loss. Anyway Hamas will have to be included in any "logical solution". Remember Thatcher, the IRA and all the rest.
It is not anti Semitic to criticize Israel's militaristic and right wing policies, though it is the usual smear. I am very sensitive to issues of racism but the antecedents of Zionism have to be recognised: Theodore Herzl, the founder of Zionism, long argued that they could never integrate because racism was endemic and universal so they must have "their own" country. That the European Jewish colonial settlement of Palestine was ³the rampart of Europe against Asia, an outpost of civilisation against barbarism²... I'm afraid it has got them into a terrible hole.. In the end they will have to accept a multiethnic state in my view. They could peacefully transition to an equal society where Palestinians are given the same rights as in post apartheid South Africa. There could be enormous economic benefits all round - as Herzl at one point envisaged (at this rate I will have to start providing source foot notes!:o)
We should stand for equal rights and justice for all.
If the current Israeli regime will not allow a democratic state or a meaningful separate Palestinian state then what? If democracy is unacceptable then apparently the plan is to slice the Palestinians into smaller and smaller areas (or body parts) and push the remainder in to neighboring countries- complete the ethnic cleansing - whilst presumably we wring our hands and our governments are quietly relieved.
If i may, I will point you at a John Pilger article (who is a rather better writer than me!:0) if you haven't already read it: http://www.coldtype.net/Assets.09/pdfs/0109.Extra1.Gaza.pdf
"Massacre of a nation"
cheers
John
[reply]John Harris @ January 26, 2009, 12:31 am
In the opening stand first of cold type (the site you recommend) this is stated:
'The state terror unleashed from the skies and on the ground against the Gaza Strip as we speak has nothing to do with Hamas. It has nothing to do with “Terror”'
This is of course not true..... Otherwise why are the Israelis not doing it in the West Bank ? Why are they not doing it in Ramallah or Nablus ? If the Israelis were just doing it because they wanted to kill Palestinians or destroy the infra structure of their lives they could bomb the West Bank..... The truth is the West Bank Palestinians are not firing rockets on Israeli cities or currently sending out suicide bombers. The attack on Gaza is entirely because Gaza is ruled by Hammas and because of actions taken by Hammas.
It does not mean the attack on Gaza is justified or a good idea in terms of the long term security of Israel. Or even that the whole precept is not a war crime.
The attack on Gaza is entirely and wholly as a response to the fact that Hammas run Gaza and that they constantly send rockets on to Israel. It is exactly the kind of vile response that Hammas are hoping to provoke, that is the point of those missiles.. They have claimed victory and indeed they have won. They want the Iranian view of the jews of Israel to be held by all.
People viewing the situation from West should not fall into the vile 'We are all Hezbollah now' rubbish thinking unless they support the wholesale slaughter of jews and they are supporters of 'From the river to the Sea' is islamic land.
I do not support the attack on Gaza.
I do understand that Hammas terror and constant rocket fire is massively important to Israeli thinking.
It is possible to be a supporter of justice for Palestinians and Palestinian rights while opposing the actions of Hammas. The actions of Hammas after all make any real negotiated solution less likely.
Liberal jews of Israel do not necessarily support an attack on Gaza...... some are organizing in opposition to it...... but all jews of Israel know that Hammas is a threat to them ..... Its charter calls for their destruction. All Israelis are right to fear Hammas it is a Islamofascist organization whose charter calls for the slaughter of the jews of Israel. Liberal people in the West should not muddle up support for human rights and justice for Palestinians with support for Hammas.
We should be clear on this.
Cheers Jez XX
PS......... I will read the rest of John Pilger later but sadly I am already pre disposed to be skeptical he is the one journalist in the world who has fallen from being a hero of mine to being someone I no longer trust.......solely because of his writing from the wars in the former Yugoslavia. He managed to pretend that the US forces whose intervention ended the ethnic cleansing and slaughter of muslim people in Bosnia were the bad guys..... and that the actual perpetrators of genocide the Serbian irregular forces were the good guys........ just because he insisted in viewing the whole conflict through a distorting view of imperialism and counter imperialism when the overwhelming issue for decent people looking in and innocent muslims living in Bosnia was the abuse of human rights and genocide.
[reply]Jezblog @ January 26, 2009, 12:34 am
The Israel's have indeed been justifying their actions by referring to rocket fire whilst they in fact broke the cease fire (& having continued the siege). As I understand it there haven't been any suicide bombings during the cease fire.
I think Lowenstein is arguing in the article you quote that the conflict is that of the powerful gaining & maintaining hegemony over the weak, and suggests Israel has not intended and will not allow a two state solution.
Israel will accept no
authority in the Palestinian territories
that it does not ultimately control. Any
individual, leader, faction or movement
that fails to accede to Israel¹s demands
or that seeks genuine sovereignty and
the equality of all nations in the region;
any government or popular movement
that demands the applicability of inter-
national humanitarian law and of the
universal declaration of human rights for
its own people will be unacceptable for
the Jewish State.
Anyway I thought you might be interested in a different perspective from the dominant narrative - which even cowers the BBC here. Still it is a powerful rhetoric and what is repeated often enough and loudly enough.... does become the justification.
The best way to undermine resistance is to find a political solution - using force hasn't crushed the Palestinians in 60 years. We should be clear on this- if Hamas are a group that can't be included in this process then some other "solution" will be found.
Using military force to destroy governments that we dislike seems to me anyway to be one of the policies the rest of the world is hoping the West & their allies might drop.
cheers
John
PS pls send me the Pilger link on the former Yugoslavia
[reply]John Harris @ January 26, 2009, 7:36 pm
http://www.srpska-mreza.com/Kosovo/NATO-attack/NATO-morality.html
'The American attack on Yugoslavia began more than a decade ago when the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund set about destroying the multi-ethnic federation with lethal doses of debt, "market reforms" and imposed poverty.'
John Im not sure this is the best example..... its just the first thing to come up on search and refers back obviously written at the time of Kosova...... but you do see how the actuality on the ground is ignored in favor of discussion about capitalism and the forces of American imperialism and the Military industrial complex.........
My own recollection is that at first the US allowed the Europeans to attempt to end the war they only intervened after the UN and Europe had completely failed........ Dutch troops had stood by and allowed the disgusting slaughter in Srebrinica....... the putrid ethnic cleansing and vile slaughter of real people meant that Clinton felt he could no longer watch and do nothing and he felt compelled to commit forces to ending the vile abuses that had characterized the Croatian and Bosnian conflict........ US soldiers intervened in Bosnia to save muslim lives...... you don't hear too much of that in Pilger's writing....... I was there thats how it went down in my recollection.
Pilger's stuff reads to me like some ridiculous Marxist professor writing from some university library in Aberdeen or Toronto miles away only referring to huge machiavellian forces real or imagined not referring to the absolute reality....... or how indeed unarmed muslim or croat families would survive the Serbian irregular forces?.......US/NATO forces combined with US/NATO diplomacy ended the Bosnian conflict and by so doing they saved thousands of Muslim lives...... thats the truth of it..... try finding that in anything Pilger has written.
Cheers Jez XX
[reply]Jezblog @ January 26, 2009, 7:42 pm
[reply]PeterS @ January 21, 2009, 6:55 pm
[reply]sherri @ January 22, 2009, 12:12 am
[reply]Julio A. Ibarra Borroto @ January 22, 2009, 12:34 am
congrats.
[reply]paolo @ January 22, 2009, 5:11 am
ps clear portrait! like it
[reply]garghe @ January 22, 2009, 6:29 am
Claus Petersen @ February 7, 2009, 7:56 pm
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